This is one of many important missing features on Envato.
Unfortunately is by many years that Envato is not updating the marketplace so this feature will never be implemented.
This is one of many important missing features on Envato.
I think a similar feature would be a lifesaver for many authors.
I think as a suggestion it’s great and completely understand your concerns and reaosning.
I am not still not entirely convinced by the potential complexity of developing that automation and more about Envato being able to/being involved by ‘giving the tools’ on their platform to transfer funds to a team member without requiring them to pay their own tax.
I understand your points about
- the submitting author paying tax on initial income
- that it is all automated to prevent authors being able to transfer manually and therefore perhaps behave badly,
but, unlike the current process envato, would be very much involved by owning the automation and I strongly doubt that they would be able to transfer/split profits to an author/team member without them paying their own tax, as this would open numerous opportunities for naughty behaviour.
Again I think that it is great to see people making recommendations and passing on ideas. Perhaps somehting could be created as an adapted version
We get what you’re saying, but our point was that it’s not that people could use this to cheat taxes, because the taxes will already be payed by the Item holder author. The other thing would only be a split after that obligations. Why would the partner would have to pay another tax just for receiving the split after taxes? It would be like saying that you need to pay taxes for the referral money you earn if that money comes from a US author.
And this would only be an issue for sales to US buyers, for every other one would be easy as there are no added taxes, only Envato fees. People would be able to withdraw what they earn including partners share to their already confirmed account (seeing that with the new changes you can only withdraw to an account to your name and with tax information validated) so this will prevent the risk of naughty behaviour.
Anyway, as we said before, we are more than open to new ideas from the Envato Team, we just want them to provide a solution for this new changes and help the community to not lose money.
I m thinking like this
Let s say i have other partner from usa, and i m from spain. Both are in the same team, account named x.
Accout is under my name.
All taxes to be calculated at the end of month, and example, from all earnings from December, let s say 500 usd, after tax to irs usa, our part is 250usd…
In my panel i have added person with name y as partner and choose procent like 50%. So on 15 he will receive 225usd.
Is not possible? Or not partner, you can say employee
What i want to say is, because using my account, taxes will be under my name and procent of tax vat etc…
That is a good example however it rather highlights by concerns.
For person y to get his cut would mean that either:
- you need to be able to transfer funds between you and that is a much bigger change than it may appear
- envato get involved again post your initial withdrawal, to send the % of that 250 to person y.
This would be a much bigger and complex workload for envato.
Plus I am almost certain that Envato (as a business) couldn’t send/transfer/withdraw funds (regardless of them being direct from the sale or from another author’s pot) which is based on another individual’s taxation.
There are also so many ways in which that could be used to evade tax or fix numbers.
Imagine as an example:
- You are a freelancer and you work with an agency to help build a website for a brand
- The agency gets paid and pay tax
- BUT you still have to pay your own separate tax on what you get paid by them
As withdrawals have to go to the individual named on the account, unless that is you, there is no way that as another individual memember of the team you could class that initial tax payment as your own.
I suppose you could create a Ltd business that all of the team members are shareholders, and then get paid to business account. Once out of envato’s hands you could split proceeds among yourselves.
Sorry, but this example is wrong. We believe you are confusing sales tax with earnings tax. Of course Partner A and Partner B will have to pay taxes, just like what happens now, but Envato doesn’t intervene on that, each author pays their own taxes to their respective countries agencies. What’s in discussion here is the US sales tax that Envato has to pay when a US person buys an item from an author from another country. That’s a sale tax, and would be payed by the item’s account author. As we told before, after the split, with the new system, the author will have to withdraw the totality of the earnings to his respective account (which will need to have all tax details confirmed) so it will prevent that naughty behavior. You won’t have to class that US tax payment as your own because you shouldn’t! you are not making the sale, you’ll just be receiving a small earning because of your work. Your example would be like saying that WalMart employees (to give an example) would have to pay taxes for all the supermarket taxes obligations when they receive their wages checks. WalMart makes the sales, and then a split or wage goes to the employees (in this case the partners) and yes, they will then pay their own taxes, but not also pay the taxes of the ones that make the sale.
As we said before, this would only be an issue for sales to US buyers, for every other one would be easy as there are no added taxes, only Envato fees.
We desperately need a tool like this, otherwise authors operating in a partnership will leave the market sooner or later. This includes us, we’re currently exploring our options if this won’t be resolved. We’re sure there are much more authors having concerns than Envato might assume. They might just don’t want to speak out or wait for developments on this situation. Creating an Ltd is not always a possibility if members are from different parts of the world and it’s not always an ideal solution even if it’s possible. We have the feeling that on the long term this will hurt not just authors but Envato as well.
The idea proposed by @Odin_Design is very much the way to do it. Other stores (e.g. Steam) and payment processors (e.g. FastSpring) all have similar solutions.
In our opinion where you get it wrong is the “after taxes” part. It should be before taxes, so each of the individual accounts in the split system can be treated separately with their own tax treaties and rates applied. Why would you want to account for the full income when it’s split among parties and you will never posses the full amount? There is no need for a primary “sale” account.
It wouldn’t interfere with Envato’s requirements. Each party in a partnership should have their own individual account. Each of them would be required to submit tax forms and identify themselves. There would be no open room to transfer funds to strange places that Envato or the government cannot track/validate. There would be no option to transfer funds between Envato accounts, the system would split the sale amount dynamically.
Envato already applies different tax rates and others to accounts from different parts of the world. This would not complicate the process. A system like this would just make the same checks in multiple times. The exact same happens when 2 customer purchases 2 separate items. They would just need to split the purchase itself and perform the same checks.
PS: We’re obviously not an expert in the area. But since other high profile stores and payment processors could solve this problem, the question is not about how can it be done but rather if Envato is willing to do it or not.
+1 for this nice idea.
It is an awesome idea and implementing this would prove that Envato is willing to do something to improve its relation with the authors after the latest decisions.
Very nice solution. Envato must consider something like this for sure.
Great Idea. I think Envato has the capacity to implement it, even better if they are interested to make something good for us. Hope they will consider it. I made near $600k sales and we are in different countries with my partners. Every solution will be good for us. If there is no solution we have to pay a lot of fees and taxes and this will make our partnership very hard.
There is nothing without a solution, except when we don’t want to make it.
We really need such tool guys, envato’s competitor had such feature already, long time ago.
This is absolutely a must-have feature for all partnerships on the market according to the latest changes. Envato must implement it.
I posted this response over on the main thread about this but I am reposting it here in case you miss it.
Envato enters into a legal agreement with the person who creates an account and agrees to the terms and conditions. This person can register as an individual or as a representative of a business/company that complies with all our usual terms (be registered in a country, put forward its tax details, receive funds to its payment accounts, and so on). As Collis announced back in 2015, for non-US authors, that business/company can be a corporation or other type of entity, but not a partnership.
There cannot be multiple owners of an Envato account. The person or business/company representative who created the account and agreed to the terms and conditions must also be same person whose details are listed on the account and in the Form W-9 or Form W-8BEN or Form W-8BEN-E associated with the account. We can only make payouts to payout destinations belonging to the person or business/company who owns the Envato account.
Because Envato enters into an agreement with the person or business/company who creates an account and agrees to the terms and conditions, we cannot recognize other types of ownership structures, including partnerships, and won’t be creating tools that might confuse that relationship.
And why not migrate to another market that pays what corresponds to us? For example, if you are not exclusive, they pay you 50%. If your Item costs $59 they pay you $29.5, and they do not discount Taxes, and just from the balance they divide the%.
Remember Envato is Big because the authors bring clients from all sides, we can do the same wherever we are.
I think if the process run successfully many author will be benefited by this. It will save many partners who actually suffer much insecure partnership