Yes. This is extremely important.
Thank you for this. Now we Can feel more Heard. Not completely but the new term is really more “contributor friendly”. There’s still some path to cross in that way for sure. But After those 2/3 last year of shady move from many stock compagnies, the feeling is better. (I’m now looking at Artlist with Motion Array for sure. Which was the worst powerful slap in face from all stock History)
4 days left and my journey on this platform ends after 13 years. But to be honest, Envato lost my trust long ego. Since the introduction of Elements there showed their true face. If you are from the US, I would try a class-action lawsuit. This is all so sketchy beyond words.
For audio and code this is a great step in the right direction. But seriously @hichameassi @BenLeong no changes for video and graphics? So instead of bulldozing over everyone you, focus where the money is as of now? If there will be no opt out option for everyone you are still very much a two-faced company that cannot be trusted.
It it’s so time consuming to implement an opt out option now for your urgent business deal, why not hire some extra horsepower in the development team, get it done and include everyone in this positive change? This is the only right thing to do if you want to start building up trust again with your community. And you will need that trust going forward for sure. In the longer run nobody should expect to be treated better then those who are treated the worst here.
For anyone cheering about the fact that now, finally, they have decided to add “opt-out”. Don’t celebrate just yet. First of all opt-outs are both traditionally useless, and impossible to know if they really opted you out. AI ML programs typically do not actually care about opt-out flags, and it’s more marketing spin to make the company seem “ethical” suddenly.
How do you intend to know that they honored your request for “opting out” they went from “we have no plans” to “okay fine” in a weekend. Ah but only for music and code though.
This is about Art, but it still applies: Artists can now opt out of generative AI. It’s not enough.
" That’s the crux of the issue: the problems that generative AI creates are structural and collective. They be solved by pushing the responsibility to individuals."
The only ethical system is opt IN, but no company is willing to do this because then they wouldn’t be able to ingest as much as they want. the vast majority of people will never even know about this until after they took from them. Even less will then trip over forum pages like this, where they can learn more about it.
These systems run on their creators not knowing whats going on until it’s too late. Because the vast majority of creatives when asked, actually want no part of this. If they truly thought it would benefit people, you would have been included in the consent.
I was able to delete my items on Audiojungle by clicking on “Edit”, then “Delete Items”. So sad
What a mess this whole thing is!
Backtracking after having aggravated and lost many of their authors… but only for some categories of authors, and no info as to why not all authors are concerned by this reversal. Will there be two version of the terms now, or are we to trust a mere email? We don’t know…
Envato tried to bully us into allowing them to sell perpetual licenses for our entire portfolio to third party companies for an undisclosed fee, of which we’ll get an undisclosed share, or leave. For some reason they did not anticipate that their bullying would backfire and they now have to backtrack via email sent to some of us…
How amateurish! This whole thing is very embarrassing for Envato’s decision makers. The lack of foresight is astonishing and telling that maybe someone is not the right fit for the job.
It sounds good
Totally agree, in these years we have only seen the destruction of this community, a community that was incredible, where we all participated actively, we were listened to. Today is history. I talk to many buyers who have escaped from this new envato, towards other platforms, we authors will do the same.
I believe that many authors have deleted their portfolio because of AI training. The decision to let them bring items back would be a good one, wouldn’t it? If the authors themselves want it, of course.
You have already made enough changes that you have deprived the authors of part of the income. Now you are imposing conditions on us that we all disagree with. I want to continue posting my work on Envato, but I do not agree that my work be used for AI training. I’m against it.
Change your policy also towards videohive authors. We also want to have the right to choose.
As the old saying goes, “When one door closes, another one opens”. New opportunities will arise from this I’m sure. Stay positive, and keep it real…good luck!
Thank you for your kind words Good luck too!
Many authors continue to use the Market because of the fixed price of the product. It makes no sense to make another Elements and sell items for 0.1 cents. If someone’s work is used in an AI-generated image/music or resold on a third party platform, they need to buy a license from Envato market each time.
This is just a spit in the face of all authors. It is the ultimate mockery and devaluation of our work. You say you think about the authors, but you only think about your ego and how to make more money and give the authors small crumbs, like for the poor and homeless. “Thank you for having pity.” (sarcasm)
OK it’s all over Now. I have deleted all my works from Videohive.
From when I joined in 2009 and until the change of leadership and the introduction of Elements it was a great time. And I am grateful to everyone who at that time made the entire Envato community better and better.
As @EightBallAudio aptly pointed out, not only is Envato offering the most absurd sale agreement where I, as the owner of the copyright property, give my consent to the disposal of my things on terms unknown to me, simply trusting the words of the corporation, but also with the recent adjustment of the agreement for authors from Audiojungle and Themeforest, Envato marked the remaining authors from Videohive and other markets as second-class authors. As they say - I thought that Envato fell to the bottom in his attitude towards the authors, but someone knocked from below.
And that’s not to mention the continued theft of our customers with Elements banners, which I wrote about back in 2018 - Does Envato act against the authors of Envato markets?
Also, in 2017 I wrote about the necessary changes for the Videohive market - Videohive has stopped (Part 1) which do not contradict the evolution of Elements, but all my words were ignored. Although shortly before this, the authors of Audiojungle received new licenses from Envato for their works but authors from Videohive didn’t. Even then it was clear that Envato had a gradation of authors. Today Envato just confirmed it.
Yes, I understand, not all authors can easily leave Envato. For some, this is the main source of income and Envato takes advantage of this by imposing horrific updates of the agreement. But if for some reason you haven’t thought about diversifying of income yet, then it’s high time. Because if you think that Envato will be better for the authors, then I have some sad news for you. Even despite the “step back” that Envato made for the authors of Audiojungle and Themeforest.
@hichameassi @BenLeong I don’t know what kind of lawyers work for you that recommended making such changes to the agreement and notifying the copyright holders simply by email, instead of turning off the portfolio or getting explicit consent from authors, but this violates every conceivable laws. Because there can be a huge number of reasons why one of the authors did not see your notification - wars, diseases, natural disasters, and even just the author has not checked his e-mail for a long time - but this does not give you the right to use the works of these authors in your own way solely discretion by unilaterally changing the terms of the agreement. I, in turn, will help everyone who encounters such a situation in order to receive large compensations from your corporation. And when the court will ask your company for prior disclosure you will not able to say that you didn’t understand or didn’t know something. You knew everything and understood everything.
I’m not against Elements. I am against the way you promoted it by stealing buyers from the authors of the main Envato markets.
I’m not against AI. I am against teaching Ai with help of my all works without even knowing how much I will receive remuneration for it.
I am not against new ways of selling my works. I am against the fact that Envato wants to get unlimited rights to my works, which Envato did not create.
Well, that’s it.
Thanks to many the authors from Audiojungle and Videohive. During this time, we have become true friends with many of you!
And a special thanks to @MarkBrodhuber for being the initiator and co-creator of Videohive. I could always write to you in a difficult situation and you always solved it wisely and fairly. Thank you!
It would be appreciated if a solution could be provided for dealing with REVERSAL items, as the Envato market has not had a solution in quite long time. As a result, our hard work has been shared and spread across various platforms without authorization from Envato. On a separate note, I’m curious about how you utilize AI technology for your work. @BenLeong @hichameassi and other community member please suggest .
Hi all. I have another batch of FAQs for tonight, starting with updates from our Legal team on a couple of older questions from further back in this thread. The first relates to model releases and third party usage:
Does a model release allow 3rd party usage, and how do acceptable use restrictions apply to this?
When an Author is looking to upload and sell an Item on Envato’s sites, if a model is the subject of the Item, they would be required to share with Envato a signed model release that indicates that the Author has rights to use the model’s likeness as part of the Item, in any media and for any purpose (commercial and non-commercial), including as part of distribution and reproduction by third parties.
On that basis, model releases should already permit third party use, however Authors may need to revisit their standard releases if this is not what their current terms state.
In regards to the use of an Item, where a customer is using the Envato sites they must comply with our Acceptable Use Policy which includes prohibiting conduct that promotes illegal activities, adult content etc. If we enter into any third party arrangement, we would expect similar obligations to be undertaken by our third parties, noting that these parties may already have similar policies in place, or would otherwise be required to implement those policies to ensure acceptable use of our Items.
And a question on take down requests:
How will we manage take down requests / DMCAs?
We will continue to manage DMCAs as we always have, which includes notifying the Author of an infringing item and takedown of the infringing item as appropriate.
If the infringing item is used as part of an arrangement between Envato and a third party, we will notify the third party and require the take down/removal of that item from their platform (including where practicable in respect of AI learning models).
On the update sent on Tuesday concerning future use of Audio, Web and Code items:
You still haven’t changed the T&Cs. Until those change, can’t Envato just say whatever it wants in emails or on the forums?
The formal email communication recently sent from Envato to our Authors was shared in order to address and clarify the arrangements covered by the updates to our T&Cs. This should be considered as incorporated into the T&Cs by reference, and we hold ourselves to the position set out in the email. For example, in the case of Audio content:
- there are no immediate plans to use audio items in third party arrangements (or generative AI); and
- if we start using audio items for these purposes, we will provide you with reasonable notice and an opt-out opportunity before we commence the first arrangement.
For clarification, do you have plans to use audio items in NON third party (i.e. Envato) arrangements including/or as part of Generative AI services?
There are no immediate plans to use audio as part of Generative AI services at all, either third party or in-house.
For Audio, Code and Web items:
Will this opt-out option apply to each arrangement moving forward? Or is it just a blanket ‘yes or no’ to all future arrangements?
As detailed in our email to you, if we start working on third-party licensing arrangements for Audio, Code or Web items, we will provide a one-off notice and opt-out process that will remove your items from all future arrangements.
And the most frequently asked question from this week:
Why aren’t we providing opt-out for Video, Photos or Graphics?
New technologies will bring transformative changes to many aspects of the stock industry over time. In the case of visual content like photos, stock videos, and design, those changes are already being felt today in varying degrees. Likewise, the licensing models and commercial arrangements in these areas are typically optimised for partnerships and wider distribution of content to maximise revenue.
On that basis, we need the ability to innovate with our visual content in order for the business to succeed in those rapidly evolving content areas, and we want to use the scale of our library to secure meaningful distribution opportunities and revenue streams for authors of these content types. We may consider providing an opt-out option in the future, but as of now, continuing to sell photos, videos and graphics through Envato after the new terms come into effect on June 1 means that you are agreeing to let us explore new revenue opportunities for you.
Well it doesn’t get any clearer than this, at least for video, photos and graphics authors.
From June 1st it’s “our” content.