Audio authors: Q&A about Envato third-party distribution and licensing

Thanks for the heads up regarding Motion Array @WaveToys Seems like they have similar AI plans, but with even less transparency. I deleted the few tracks I have there, only generates peanuts anyway. Of course harder decision if one have significant income there, but it’s crazy that most authors don’t even know about this and AI is not mentioned with one word in the terms.

I think this sums it up nicely.

After Envato gives another round of feedback, somebody with some understanding of whats happening should make a clear and easy to read summary about the risks of having their portfolio under an agreement like this. Then we should share it with as many authors as possible. Not everybody has time and capacity to read and get updated on what’s really happening.

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Hello everyone,

I want to bring up an important matter that affects all of us as authors.

Some companies state in their terms and conditions that they can use the digital items we provide on the marketplace for AI training. This practice can infringe upon our rights as consumers and authors, especially when the company only provides an opt-out option for this clause, whereas it should be an opt-in option.

We must be aware of our rights and take action to protect them.

Many creators claimed they lost a lot of money because of terms changes like P5 and MA and never sent one letter or e-mail to check if these changes were legal.

If you are an Elements Author (or not), you can also talk about Elements issues like the 50 % to 25 % cut change or if it was legitimate to remove the content bonus payments.

We must raise our voices and stand up for our rights.

Let’s work together to ensure our rights are upheld!

The largest problem, in my opinion, is that you have to submit all of your tracks for AI learning, but you have no idea how much it will pay—and if it only pays $2, you are unable to cancel. Will you get paid consistently each time an AI creates a new song using one of your tracks? Or will the AI learn from you just once, take your data already, and never pay you again?

Best Regards,

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Hello! Envato Team,

I’ve been a music creator on Envato since 2016. You recently invited authors to submit their portfolios for Generative II teaching without details of payments and fees. However:

  1. You did not indicate the amount of rewards.
  2. Copyright issues and the future role of authors after AI training are unclear.
  3. There is no information about Possible copyright issues for authors and in the YouTube ContentID system

Until there is clarity on these issues, I refuse to make my work available for AI training.

I hope that Envato will treat our questions with respect and understanding and provide comprehensive answers.

All the best Timur Khakimov

Hello! Envato Team,

I’ve been a music creator on Envato since 2016. You recently invited authors to submit their portfolios for generative AI training without details of payments and fees. However:

  1. You did not indicate the amount of rewards.
  2. Copyright issues and the future role of authors after AI training are unclear.
  3. There is no information about Possible copyright issues for authors and in the YouTube ContentID system

Until there is clarity on these issues, I refuse to make my work available for AI training.

I hope that Envato will treat our questions with respect and understanding and provide comprehensive answers.

All the best Timur Khakimov

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Dear Envato,

I am writing in response to the letter I received concerning the training of Ai models using my music. My concerns about this matter are in complete alignment with those of my fellow authors. I must inform you that I will not participate in this program, nor will I permit the use of my music for AI training, unless you provide comprehensive details regarding compensation, royalty fees, and potential conflicts with PRO, CID, and publishers.

Sincerely,
Kyrylo Momot

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I’m small potatoes here, but I opted out. I gather it does not matter since 95% will probably not even realize what is going on and pass over the opt out. I stopped uploading here last year as soon as Elements took over. I’m already selling music at 1/10 its actual value, with the AI training and 3rd party unknown, it could be 1/100. Proper licensing deals for music can range from $500 to anywhere. We already sell for $20 and $30 in hopes that it will sell multiple times. Well, after some AI training with your music, you will get paid once and that’s all.

The only thing keeping AI at bay, is the issue of copyright. If we sign away that, AI has the right to rape your music and throw you away.

Not to mention what others said about violating licenses of instrument libraries like OT and Keepforest.

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Envato’s legal team can move forward with “you are considered to be opted in” unless you actively “opt out”, but they should be aware of USA case law that have set precedents when using that aggessive/ predatory approach:

Several court cases illustrate that “opt out” notifications alone can be insufficient for establishing legally binding contracts or settlements, especially when more robust forms of consent are required.

  1. Wright v. Linkus Enterprises, Inc.: In this case, the court determined that relying solely on “opt out” procedures for Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) claims was insufficient. The court emphasized that under the FLSA, employees must “opt in” to be bound by a settlement, thereby requiring affirmative consent rather than passive non-action​ (Overtime Law Blog)​.
  2. Kakani v. Oracle Corp.: The Northern District of California found that using “opt out” notices to bind employees to FLSA settlements was inappropriate. The court held that it would be “unconscionable” to strip workers of their FLSA rights without their affirmative consent​ (Overtime Law Blog)​.
  3. E.D. Cal.: Settlement of Rule 23 and 216(b) Class Hybrid Action: The Eastern District of California also highlighted the insufficiency of “opt out” notices in a hybrid action involving both Rule 23 class actions and FLSA collective actions. The court mandated that “opt in” notices were necessary for FLSA claims to ensure proper consent​ (The Holland Law Firm, P.C.)​.

These cases illustrate that courts often require more than just “opt out” notices to ensure that individuals are fully aware and consent to being bound by legal agreements or settlements, especially in the context of employment and labor laws.

Is Envato doing it’s due diligence by merely sending an e-mail to all music authors stating “You will be considered OPTED IN, unless you actively OPT OUT using this link?”

Will every author actually see, read, and fully comprehend that email notification? What happens if the email ends up in “Junk”, “SPAM” or was never received due to an email box being “full”?

What if the Email was accidntally deleted without being read by non active music authors with active accounts who are simply disengaged with the music licesning business, but still have an account to obtain passive monthly income?

I did some research on the concept of “Opt Out” notifications and Envato’s legal team should be aware of this legal concept / opinion below. For the record this is not my writing. I am copying and pasting this from some research I did on line and it states :

"Whether an “opt-out” constitutes a legally binding contract depends on several factors, including the jurisdiction, the specific terms of the agreement, and the manner in which the opt-out notice is communicated and received.

1. Clear and Conspicuous Notice: The email notification must clearly and conspicuously inform the individual of the opt-out terms. This means the information should be easy to find and understand.
2. Reasonable Opportunity to Opt-Out: The individual must be given a reasonable opportunity to opt out. This involves allowing adequate time and providing straightforward instructions on how to opt out.
3. Acceptance and Assent: For a contract to be legally binding, there generally needs to be mutual acceptance and assent to the terms. Simply sending an email without ensuring the recipient actually received and read it may not meet this standard.
4. Jurisdiction-Specific Regulations: Different jurisdictions have varying standards for what constitutes a legally binding contract, especially in the context of electronic communications. For example, certain consumer protection laws might require explicit consent rather than implied consent through an opt-out mechanism.
5. Previous Relationship and Established Practices: The nature of the relationship between the company and the individual and any established practices regarding communication and agreements can also influence whether an opt-out mechanism is considered legally binding.

In summary, while an “opt-out” notice sent via email can potentially be part of a legally binding contract, it must be clearly communicated, provide a reasonable opportunity to act, and meet the legal standards of mutual consent and acceptance. It is advisable for companies to seek legal counsel to ensure compliance with relevant laws and regulations."

So since imposing “opting out” as the only of course action the author has to take, and let’s face it, this aggressive tactic and strategy clearly benifits one party in the transaction: ENvato. The Author and owner of the content does not beneifit from this policy as they are forcibly “opted in” unless they “actively opt out”. I really think it’s in Envato’s best legal interests to send a new email asking authors to “Opt into” 3rd party revenue streams that engage in AI Training of human authored music works/ sound recordings.

Generative AI Music is brand new, it’s developing fast, laws regulating the technology have yet to be developed, royalty structures and norms for this new way of creating music have NOT BEEN ESTABLISHED. With the Major Record labels filing lawsuits against two major players in generative AI music: SUNO and UDIO, for copyright infringement, I really would think that it would be wise of Envato to obtain full written consent with author signatures, and counter signatures by Envato where there is no doubt that both parties gave their FULL CONSENT to the new agreement / terms of service, to sell/ license digital goods (owned by authors) on this platform to 3rd party AI companies which are most likely NVIDIA, META, APPLE, GOOGLE, MICROSOFT, OPEN AI, ADOBE, SUNO, UDIO (In my humble opinion). Yes, I am of the opinion that “YOU WILL BE OPTED IN” unless you actively OPT OUT, is sketchy at best, and considered NOT LEGALLY BINDING by a judge or a jury, at worst. Rememeber ENVATO Legal Team, The major labels are seeking damages of $150,000 per illegally ingested song that trainied SUNO and UDIO’s AI Models.

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I honestly hope that I help ENVATO’s Legal team by posting this. I also hope that I bring a level of comfort to some authors who are polarized by these changing times and predatory actions MEGA CAP TECH companies are taking against free-lance artists and creators all over the world. Below in Italics is more research I did. By The way: ENVATO, Can I invoice you for the research work I am doing to PROTECT YOUR LEGAL INTERESTS? LOL!

Case law specifically addressing situations where freelance artists were considered “opted in” to new terms of service if they did not “actively opt out” through electronic notifications is limited. However, general legal principles and precedents involving similar situations can provide relevant insights.

1. Douglas v. U.S. District Court (9th Circuit, 2007): In this case, the court ruled that merely posting terms on a website and sending a notification via email was insufficient for binding a user to those new terms without explicit consent. This ruling emphasizes that significant changes to a contract require more than passive acceptance.
2. Nguyen v. Barnes & Noble Inc. (9th Circuit, 2014): This case reinforced that for a user to be bound by terms of service, there must be evidence of explicit consent, such as clicking an “I agree” button. Passive notice through email or merely posting terms online does not constitute agreement.
3. Specht v. Netscape Communications Corp. (2nd Circuit, 2002): The court held that for terms to be binding, users must have adequate notice and an opportunity to review the terms. Simply making terms available via hyperlink without ensuring users have actively agreed to them is not sufficient.

These cases highlight the importance of explicit consent and adequate notice for terms of service to be enforceable. For freelance artists, or any individuals, being bound by new terms requires more than just an email notification or passive “opt out” option. Explicit agreement and clear notice are critical to forming a legally binding contract.

References:

** Douglas v. U.S. District Court, 495 F.3d 1062 (9th Cir. 2007)*
** Nguyen v. Barnes & Noble Inc., 763 F.3d 1171 (9th Cir. 2014)*
** Specht v. Netscape Communications Corp., 306 F.3d 17 (2nd Cir. 2002)*

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This is a big one guys!

Harris v. Blockbuster, Inc. , 622 F. Supp. 2d 396 (N.D. Tex. 2009),[1] established precedent in the district that when a contract has a clause that authorizes one party to make changes to the “contract” without notification, that it is illusory and hence the entire “contract” is void.

Envato really needs to move forward with a great deal of caution. I highly advise Envato to look at case law as it relates to changing your terms of service and on a web site. You are SUBSTANTIALLY changing the contract between authors and your company when you propose Unless you opt out, we assume you are opted into our new agreement where you allow us to license your music property to 3rd party AI companies for a price that we solely determine, and we do not know what we can or will pay you for these new deals we hope to make, and we do not know if the royalties are one time only, or recurring.

ENVATO, do what is right: first explain how the compensation will work for the AI dataset deals, and then seek out FULL CONSENT from the willing authors who want to participate through full blown “opt in by way of e-signature and counter signature” where they can be given 6 weeks to review a new contract outlining this new 3rd party revenue stream, which we all know is ingesting everyone’s music property/ digital sound recordings into an AI learning/ training model. We also know the outputs that the Generative AI music model will sound similar to it’s inputs (Everyone’s music tracks). We all know that an AI music output is only as good as it’s human authored and created input. We also know that this can, has, and will most likely create copyright infringment claims, inadvertently on YOUTUBE, META PLATFORMS, FACEBOOK, TIK TOK, VIMEO, and other social media platforms.

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That’s a good point! Indeed many authors don’t know what’s happening with Envato. Thank you for the research and detailed information! Opted out!

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You can most certainly send them an invoice.
Unless they opt out.
:crazy_face:

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Heya @MomotMusic. You will need to use the web form to opt-out. You will have received the link in the email. Thanks!

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Hi Kingdog, There are exactly 21 days remaining for authors to “opt out” by clicking “Do not use my Audio content in any third-party agreements” Using this link below:

I am just curious, has your company completed it’s response? or will there be more commentary from Envato about the ensuing AI Training ingestion and compensation / payment structure to authors who are opted in?

Will Envato ever reveal the exact names of these “3rd party” companies? If not, what’s the big secret? What does Envato have to hide?

Will Envato reveal what these companies do and what there intentions are for gaining access to those authors (and their music data) who decide to “opt in”?

What time zone is the deadline in?

I only ask because my Midnight July 29 time zone is already July 30 in Europe and Australia. Example: as of now it’s already July 9 in Sydney, but it’s July 8 in USA, Canada, and Europe.

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Hi, It seams I missed the email so I have opened a ticket 3593986.
Can you please send an email again. Regards

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Is there a confirmation after we opt-out?

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@BenLeong (enjoy your holidays! :blush:) @KingDog, as @MeGustaMusic asked, I’m also interested in confirming my opt-out.

I hope you guys can share some information soon so we can make a decision based on the actual terms of these new strategies.

Thanks in advance!

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I received an e-mail confirming it.

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The only thing I received is a mail from Google stating that I had submitted the Google form. It feels a little light.

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I 100% agree. After all these years with Envato, we at least deserve to be treated with respect. We have the right to know more: how exactly our music will be used? Where? What would be our share from all this? And so on.

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