A question for PRS members on here


#1

I recently had a meeting with a senior manager of the PRS, talking about a TV show I recently scored.

I mentioned that I also sell music on here, but when I mentioned that the music I produce for here doesn’t get registered with PRS as we can’t due to AJ rules, he alarmingly told me that as a PRS member, i’m under a contractual obligation to register all music I compose that is publicly available with PRS, not doing so is a breach of the PRS writers contract…

Naturally I’m pretty alarmed, and obviously if this is the case, pretty annoyed that I’ll have to remove all music from here and find another avenue for selling the tracks.

I did send a support ticket here, but it was pretty useless as they could not clarify or give me any information to back up that selling on here using un-registered PRS tracks is OK, almost as though they don’t know themselves, so they just told me to clear this with PRS.

My thoughts are, if its contractually binding that being a member of PRS means I can’t sell un registered tracks, why would Envato allow PRS members to sell on here?

Is there anyone on here who could give me some insight?

I’d hate to close my account as things are starting to work well on here and I love being a part of the community…

Thanks :slight_smile:


#2

Mike Sea should be able help you on this. :slight_smile:

Seriously, I’ve tried to explain all this quite few times but unfortunately no one seems to understand.

I’ll just say that what you have been told is correct from a PRS standpoint.


#3

Thanks, yeah I do think I may be heading to the end of my audio jungle path if thats the case… I really can’t jeopardise my position with PRS, as the film in particular is a huge show with world wide commissions.


#4

Before you do anything hasty, I would certainly talk with Envato senior staff and get some clarity on their future position with maybe, having a different contract with PRO members. That’s a long shot, but you never know.

I have mentioned this to the members here a thousand times, been questioned and occasionally ridiculed, but the problem is a lot of people live in denial and just don’t get the difference.

But don’t forget, this is the PRS position. Other PROs may take similar or entirely different standpoints. Although the latter is probably doubtful.


#5

Hey brother.
All PROs is the same man.
On the contract they specify that all MUSIC CREATED UNDER YOUR NAME has to be on their catalogue. If you want to write royaltyroyalty free music . Create a company and publish your rf track with the company’s name.


#6

Aah, that makes sense why many sellers on here aren’t using their real names. Should have read the small print.

Thanks guys for your input, really helpful. Pretty disappointed, but hey, that’s life…

Better start deleting.


#8

I would really be interested in some facts regarding this topic.

What I know is that GEMA (German PRO) actually DOES demand composers to register ALL of their work, if you are a GEMA member. That’s why I never became a member in the first place…

Anyway - I was under the impression that BMI for example will…

  1. …let composers from any country become a BMI member and
  2. …allow composers (members) to decide which tracks they want to register.

Could anybody confirm this - regarding BMI? Are there any other PROs out there that allow this?

As a german composer I’m currently looking for a PRO - yet I don’t want to become a GEMA member exactly because of this insane “Register-All-Music” policy.

For those who are interested: There’s an alternative PRO forming in Germany, the ‘C3S’ (I’ve been supporting them since they started…) - but it might still take years until they’re fully established. That’s why I’m looking for an alternative outside of Germany.


#9

I can say we have exactly the same situation in Sweden. If you are connected to STIM (PRO organisation in Sweden) you simply can’t put any tracks on RF-libraries. What is happening here is that Epidemic Sounds (the biggest RF-library in Sweden) gets the blame for not letting STIM-connected artists sell their RF tracks there, when it in fact is STIM that claims their right to control (perhaps not the right word) EVERY track you publish.
What I simply can’t understand is why STIM (or your PRO) doesn’t let you decide which track you want to connect to STIM and with ones you decide not to.


#10

So what i’m trying to understand is, if as a registered PRS member, why do Envato knowingly ask, and when you say you are, they allow you to be a member? It seems very bad that they wouldn’t flag to an author that the can’t sell on here if they are PRS registered. It’s very misleading on their part.

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PRS Members (UK) thread
#11

I don’t think that this actually is the responsibility of envato (never thought I’d say this one day…).

As far as I know (but would like to have confirmed - see my post above) there are PROs out there that do actually allow members to sell their music on RF sites. These PROs basically allow you to decide for yourself which tracks you want to register with them.

The tracks you do register couldn’t be sold through AJ (that’s also what the extra notice in your screenshot says). Music you don’t register could be sold on AJ. (In which case you’d be a PRO member but could still sell not-pro-registered tracks on AJ…).

So - as far as I understand this - it really depends on the PRO’s policy. If they ‘force’ you to register ALL of your music with them, you basically can’t sell your music on AJ.


#12

i am with BMI and its the same with others ! All music created under your name MUST be registered to BMI


#13

Interesting, thanks for sharing. So, how do you do this, did you create a company to sell here?


#14

you can create a company… a publisher or anything you like.!I hate that Pros have this on their contracts ! most of RF stock markets have the option to sell PRO music ! i think Envato will do the same soon !


#15

This is pretty surprising to hear about. I’ve never heard of this before and I’m sure that 100’s of authors on here are registered with PRO’s.

Is clause 2a what you are referring to?
http://www.prsformusic.com/SiteCollectionDocuments/Membership/prs-standard-terms-of-asignment-writers.pdf


#16

Wow - ok, that really is a surprise… Thanks for the info!

Does anybody know if there’s any PRO at all that allows composers to decide, which tracks they want to register?

Ideally a PRO that allows composers from Germany to become a member?


#17

I’m not quite sure at this point what other PROs do or don’t do helps the OP. The position of the PRS is the only thing that is going to matter in this instance, because he’s registered with them. It’s fantastic to read what other people actually think.

I would advise quite few of you to stop thinking and deal with facts as they are at the present time.


#18

Well, I was obviously asking about facts, not thoughts. That’s all I’m interested in. And: I was asking on my own behalf…

Anyway - sorry for hijacking this thread, if this was too far off topic. I guess I’ll open another one then.


#19

Apart from the OP who had the good sense to actually talk to someone from the PRS, which incidentally I have quite often FYI, have any of you actually ever read a contract? Do you even know what a contract means?

It’s a legally binding document. When some of you grow up and find yourself signing contracts to buy a house, sign a Trust or a Will, you will find that it’s not a video game and you can’t use the reset switch and start again.


#20

Well, as you address all in this thread, I shall answer for myself: I spent 10 years in a job managing legal disputes against literally hundreds of companies all over the world so yes, I know what a contract is: A piece of paper which is binding - as long as the parties involved want it to be binding. I have seen so many contracts fall apart in front of a court that I can only laugh at your simplistic rant. If you really think that this issue is as black and white as buying a house or signig a will you’re extemely naive. So, rather than getting all worked up, why don’t you say what you have to say on topic? Oh, and yes, I own real estate.


#21

Sometimes I am quite shocked at the rudeness and disrespect some authors show to others, there really is no need for it. Be polite on the forums it’s nice!